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Padron Renewal
Re: Padron Renewal
by Bee » Sat Sep 28, 2019 8:43 am
If you are paying non-resident income tax in Spain then you have declared that your address in Spain is not your habitual place of residence i.e where you live for the greater part of the year. So officially according to the INE ( Institute Nacional de Estadisticas), whose function it is to collect and collate the information from each Municipality, you should not be on the Register as being on the register also gives you the right to vote in local elections. Most Municipalities give you a 3 months temporary certificate which is then cancelled if you don't present your residencia or proof of applying for your residencia. All illegal immigrants are actively encouraged to sign on the Municipal Padron in order to be able to avail of medical, social and educational facilities of their Municipality and also when it comes to applying formally for citizenship, strange as it may seem, they can show that they have been habitually resident in Spain for the required period of time.
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Re: Padron Renewal
by Paulr » Sat Sep 28, 2019 6:23 pm
ElcheDave is correct, it is illegal to sign on to the Padron unless you are resident in Spain.
The confusion is caused by Ayuntamientos (town halls), e.g. Rojales, who encourage non-residents to sign on to the Padron, as this enables the Ayuntamiento to claim extra money from central government. The big problem here is that people think, "Oh, it's OK, my town hall is telling me to do it, so it must be OK". WRONG! It isn't the town halls that will be fined if it's discovered, the individuals will be.
As for the comment that people who live in areas where town halls don't encourage this behaviour also frown upon it, I'm afraid the point hasn't been made. The money that town halls claim from central government is coming out of income raised by taxing Spanish residents, of which I'm one. Why should Rojales (or any other town hall for that matter), with the claim of having the largest urbanisation in Europe (since Quesada overtook La Marina several years ago) be entitled to take money from central government to support a large, non-resident population, at the expense of those of us who are resident here and paying our taxes to the Spanish government? I understand that those of you doing this won't give a damn about me or other Spanish tax payers, but I hope that understanding the responsibility for breaking the law rests with you, rather than the town halls, will make you think twice.
And the relevant Spanish law is Ley 4/1996:
Artículo 15.
Toda persona que viva en España está obligada a inscribirse en el Padrón del municipio en el que resida habitualmente. Quien viva en varios municipios deberá inscribirse únicamente en el que habite durante más tiempo al año.
Article 15.
All persons living in Spain are obliged to register in the Register of the municipality in which they habitually reside. If you live in several municipalities, you must register only in the one you live in for the longest period of the year.
Artículo 16.
1. El Padrón municipal es el registro administrativo donde constan los vecinos de un municipio. Sus datos constituyen prueba de la residencia en el municipio y del domicilio habitual en el mismo. Las certificaciones que de dichos datos se expidan tendrán carácter de documento público y fehaciente para todos los efectos administrativos.
Article 16.
1. The Municipal Register is the administrative register where the residents of a municipality are registered. Your details are proof of residence in the municipality and your usual residence there. The certifications that are issued from said data will have the character of a public and reliable document for all administrative purposes.
The articles refer to habitual residence.
Son infracciones graves:
... la inscripción de un extranjero en el Padrón Municipal ... cuando dicha vivienda no constituya el domicilio real del extranjero. Se incurrirá en una infracción por cada persona indebidamente inscrita.
Serious infractions:
... the registration of a foreigner in the Municipal Register ... when said dwelling does not constitute the real domicile of the foreigner. An infraction will be incurred for each person wrongly registered.
The confusion is caused by Ayuntamientos (town halls), e.g. Rojales, who encourage non-residents to sign on to the Padron, as this enables the Ayuntamiento to claim extra money from central government. The big problem here is that people think, "Oh, it's OK, my town hall is telling me to do it, so it must be OK". WRONG! It isn't the town halls that will be fined if it's discovered, the individuals will be.
As for the comment that people who live in areas where town halls don't encourage this behaviour also frown upon it, I'm afraid the point hasn't been made. The money that town halls claim from central government is coming out of income raised by taxing Spanish residents, of which I'm one. Why should Rojales (or any other town hall for that matter), with the claim of having the largest urbanisation in Europe (since Quesada overtook La Marina several years ago) be entitled to take money from central government to support a large, non-resident population, at the expense of those of us who are resident here and paying our taxes to the Spanish government? I understand that those of you doing this won't give a damn about me or other Spanish tax payers, but I hope that understanding the responsibility for breaking the law rests with you, rather than the town halls, will make you think twice.
And the relevant Spanish law is Ley 4/1996:
Artículo 15.
Toda persona que viva en España está obligada a inscribirse en el Padrón del municipio en el que resida habitualmente. Quien viva en varios municipios deberá inscribirse únicamente en el que habite durante más tiempo al año.
Article 15.
All persons living in Spain are obliged to register in the Register of the municipality in which they habitually reside. If you live in several municipalities, you must register only in the one you live in for the longest period of the year.
Artículo 16.
1. El Padrón municipal es el registro administrativo donde constan los vecinos de un municipio. Sus datos constituyen prueba de la residencia en el municipio y del domicilio habitual en el mismo. Las certificaciones que de dichos datos se expidan tendrán carácter de documento público y fehaciente para todos los efectos administrativos.
Article 16.
1. The Municipal Register is the administrative register where the residents of a municipality are registered. Your details are proof of residence in the municipality and your usual residence there. The certifications that are issued from said data will have the character of a public and reliable document for all administrative purposes.
The articles refer to habitual residence.
Son infracciones graves:
... la inscripción de un extranjero en el Padrón Municipal ... cuando dicha vivienda no constituya el domicilio real del extranjero. Se incurrirá en una infracción por cada persona indebidamente inscrita.
Serious infractions:
... the registration of a foreigner in the Municipal Register ... when said dwelling does not constitute the real domicile of the foreigner. An infraction will be incurred for each person wrongly registered.
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Re: Padron Renewal
by marcliff » Sat Sep 28, 2019 8:22 pm
I've been here now for 15 years. Judging by how litigious the authorities are over here, I've never heard of one person or one council that has been fined for putting someone on the padron who shouldn't be.
I do know that Rojales, and other councils, have been challenging the definition of residence as in the only house owned in Spain and it becomes their primary Spanish residence.
Pretty sure someone would have been done by now if it were so cut and dried so it must be a pretty poorly drafted piece of legislation.
And, yes, I know other councils have stopped it as we were on the Orihuela Costa and Torrevieja padrons 15 or so years ago.
I do know that Rojales, and other councils, have been challenging the definition of residence as in the only house owned in Spain and it becomes their primary Spanish residence.
Pretty sure someone would have been done by now if it were so cut and dried so it must be a pretty poorly drafted piece of legislation.
And, yes, I know other councils have stopped it as we were on the Orihuela Costa and Torrevieja padrons 15 or so years ago.
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marcliff - Posts: 9694
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