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Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
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Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by Paul Uden » Sun Dec 13, 2015 11:30 am
Please can someone tell me the law on smoking in restaurants and bars? The context of the question is that there are several establishments which allow smoking inside when 80% of the room is not open to the outside (i.e. roof and three of the four sides). This occurs particularly in winter when terraces are covered in by awnings and some restaurants even allow it inside the front section bordering the road when the 'awning windows' are closed. I am not inviting a debate on the whys and wherefores of smoking in public places, I would just like clarification of the law from someone who knows please.
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Re: Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by Jan » Sun Dec 13, 2015 11:49 am
Paul Uden wrote:Please can someone tell me the law on smoking in restaurants and bars? The context of the question is that there are several establishments which allow smoking inside when 80% of the room is not open to the outside (i.e. roof and three of the four sides). This occurs particularly in winter when terraces are covered in by awnings and some restaurants even allow it inside the front section bordering the road when the 'awning windows' are closed. I am not inviting a debate on the whys and wherefores of smoking in public places, I would just like clarification of the law from someone who knows please.
Yes I have noticed that. The law is a European law and same in UK and Spain and it does say smoking inside anywhere in a public place is against the law. In the UK the smoking areas are outside but I suppose the Spanish are interpreting the law as 'outside' even though it may be in an enclosed attached awning. Some bars & restaurants have a bigger awnings than their inside area, so it can be quite difficult to find somewhere to sit away from the smokers in some places.
I don't smoke but I'm not anti-smoking and believe in the freedom of adults to smoke if they wish, as long as it's not in a public enclosed place. As Paul Uden says, we don't want a debate on smoking but it's interesting to find out the correct law on public places and how Spain interprets it.
It must be the same legislation as this:
The main points of the legislation from a UK website are as follows:
"The legislation, introduced on the 1st July 2007, now makes it illegal to smoke in all public enclosed or substantially enclosed area and workplaces.
The ban includes smoking on vehicles which serve the public and / or are used for work purposes.
Appropriate no smoking signs must be clearly placed in all smoke free premises and vehicles.
Under the legislation in place work smoking rooms and areas are no longer permitted. All smokers must take their smoke breaks outside.
The owners / managers of any premises have to take reasonable steps to ensure that all staff and/or visitors are aware of the ban and to uphold the ban.
Smokers looking for an appropriate place to smoke may check the no smoking signs in and around premises to easily see which areas are restricted or ask a staff members.
"How an Area is Classed as Enclosed or Substantially Enclosed
All areas open to the public including workplaces are considered smoke free zones where they are enclosed or substantially enclosed.
Enclosed: This is an area with permanent walls and doors without any gaps. Windows and doors aren’t classed as gaps. An enclosed structure may be permanent i.e. a building or even a marquee (temporary).
Substantially Enclosed:
This would be a structure (with a roof/ceiling) with an opening in the walls where the opening would make up less than half of the area of the total wall space. Again doors and windows are not classed as gaps.
If in any doubt about whether their building or structure is enclosed, substantially enclosed or open enough to allow smoking in the wisest course of action for businesses would be to contact the local council for advice and clarification.
from http://www.smokefreeengland.co.uk/what- ... ick-guide/
Jan
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Re: Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by scubydoo » Sun Dec 13, 2015 12:49 pm
Yes what they do is ilegal I don't like it but they are just trying to keep some customers happy! the best thing to do is vote with your feet.
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Re: Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by marcliff » Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:45 pm
It is not a European law. The EU has never legislated on smoking and these are national laws (witness Belgium and the Netherlands who have scrapped them).
Here I think they have "outside" areas and keep them as that all year round even though they cover them over in the cooler months.
We sit outside in the summer when it is open but sit inside during the winter.
Here I think they have "outside" areas and keep them as that all year round even though they cover them over in the cooler months.
We sit outside in the summer when it is open but sit inside during the winter.
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Re: Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by Shiva » Sun Dec 13, 2015 11:30 pm
As Marcliff says I understand these are national laws and not European laws . While in the UK they place a lot of stress on the degree of 'enclosure' I very much like the Spanish interpretation of the terraces ( whether under awnings or not ) as 'outside' ( and smoking permitted) with only the permanent inside bit classed as 'inside' where smoking is not allowed. This gives space to non-smokers while not completely persecuting smokers. Frankly I think it is a much more tolerant approach than in the UK .( Incidentally I am a non-smoker, so not grinding any axes .)
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Re: Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by SALUKI » Mon Dec 14, 2015 4:48 pm
I am belgian and it's forbidden to smoke in ALL public places: cafés, hotel,town hall, airport, trainstation, train platforms etc...even forbidden in football stadiums. Smoking allowed in open air. Parliament is working on extending the law to forbidden smoking inside car...
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Re: Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by Paul Uden » Tue Dec 15, 2015 2:37 pm
Thank you all for your responses. I am still not clear on the actual law because answers range from "its illegal" to the Spanish have 'interpreted the law' to allow smoking in so-called 'outside' areas even when they are effectively 'inside' during the winter. There are a couple of larger restaurants on Avda de Las Naciones which seem to do it all year long (one of which I was told had been sanctioned for doing so), but there are many bars in Quesada which allow smoking under fully enclosed awnings. I remember when the laws first came in and I thought that then you had to have at least two sides open to the outside air and there was something at that time about establishments of sufficient size being allowed to have designated smoking areas. However, it would seem that now the authorities are certainly turning a blind eye to smoking on enclosed terraces in winter. In this case I suppose sitting right inside or voting with your feet are the only practical answers, as suggested.
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Re: Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by Norfolk-in-chance » Wed Dec 16, 2015 9:35 am
I am a smoker and utilise the outside spaces provided by bar owners. My advice is if you don't smoke stay indoors where you'll be happy and smokers outside are happy.
I've noticed that nonsmokers gravitate towards smoking areas, not sure why?
I've noticed that nonsmokers gravitate towards smoking areas, not sure why?
Just do it
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Re: Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by Paul Uden » Wed Dec 16, 2015 11:20 am
Whether the contributors to this discussion are smokers or non-smokers is irrelevant. This started as a query about effectively the legal definitions of "indoors" and "outside". The comment assuming that smokers are happy outside and non smokers inside is straying in a direction this thread does not need to go so I am happy for it to be closed down now Jan (if you are following the discussion).
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Re: Smoking in restaurants and bars - the law
by Jan » Wed Dec 16, 2015 11:22 am
Interesting topic. Thanks to all contributors.
Topic now locked.
Topic now locked.
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